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Im not an artist, im a dreamer...

Hammi 4 Real @Hammi

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Why I hated the Art Forum

Posted by Hammi - December 11th, 2008


Just ranting to get it off my chest. I dont care if you think its stupid, this is my news post and i gotta get this shit out. I thought id write down my side of a story, that would grow to be a rather conflicting one during my long time stay at the art forum. This rant might be depressing, user-negative or disturbing for some readers so discretion is advised.

My boring rant

Lets take it back to '06. The first time i had discovered the art forum. Full of life. And people who were really passionate with art. At that time i was 18. At that point, i wasnt taking art seriously. I had in fact stopped drawing since 14. But then one day, i went digi nuts... whatever you want to call it. Truth is, ive been a Digimon fanatic since i was 15 ever since it came out. And at age 18, my very first online drawing submission was a doodle of Renamon. Shes a very strong kitsune digimon fyi. I was also a member of a digimon fan site, Renamon.Nl (which is now defunct, and the admin and i are mortal enemies lmfao). That site used to be my very first online art portfolio where i submitted some few Rena fan arts, before i settled down in the NG art forum. I saw the glowing artistic essence in that forum full of people who had the power to create, and i was just fuckin turned on. Also another opportunity for me to contribute to NG, a long time beloved site which ive been lurking at since 99. I had promised myself to never join until i had something worth contributing to the site. So i made some music (pff). And i was in. Anyways back to the art forum. I decided to contribute to the forum, and jesus wow. Eye rape. I was very humble to the forum back then and i graciously asked for help from the other artists, who i wanted to be under their wings. Me as the new guy, i considered them as supreme artists who i would learn from and grow from their influence. Later, i made friends. Obviously from joining art collabs and being active, while being very bright and helpful. Yes, that was a great time for me. For me it was a golden era where i had people who supported me and who really valued my growing art work in an equal way like others. And i grew on that support. I was home. They even helped me up when i was down, when i was at the brink of leaving art behind. One of them was MindChamber, and i owe him a lot for being an understanding and sympathetic fella. We're still down to this day.

But sadly, old regs started leaving. One by one. Maybe they had other plans. And soon came a new wave of new regs. But it didnt stop me from drawing. I figured if i kept on drawing, i would still be able to receive feedback to improve my art skills. But despite many tries, i felt ignored. And that was the start of my many doubts on the forum that would later occur. At the same time, many of the new members turned out to be very ambitious. At first i didnt mind though, although this is what had me started competing with others. But what had me extra frustrated was that i felt like all the help i had offered was a waste of time, and i felt unappreciated because of that. Whenever i posted something new, i was no longer noticed and was rather blown off from the first page right away because some other more recognized regs had caught everybodys attention. This also lead me to believe that i really was shitty and that i had no right to call myself an artist. I felt like i was nothing. Then all of a sudden we had the art forum awards which really reflected the view of the art forum regs on each others. The voting was complete. The regs had spoken. This event was enormously depressing for me. I mean, where was i during whole 2007? I thought people already recognized my spot... that is, IF I EVER HAD A SPOT. And i was KIND OF expecting some respect because i stayed strictly loyal to the place for a whole year, but instead it turns out all my efforts on helping people around me werent worth jack shit after all. This left me hugely unappreciated and permanently half broken, and this is what basically had me starting to hate the art forum. I felt like an outcast. I was bumped out, with my less impressive works. Alienated from a community i used to think i was a part of. So i gradually started leaving the forum, to move off to another place. And found a new home where artists are way more open than most people here are used to. And i love it.

Seriously, its really hard to be optimistic about the art forum. Been there for some years, you thought you were cool with everybody. Then the next thing you know, youre all by yourself fiddling with your non-interesting drawings. Ever had the feeling that all the time when you thought you were meant for a place, but then later you find out that youve only been jerking around not achieving anything for the past years? WELL BOY. DO I. But i still hung around, hoping to eventually find someone who was really into what i made and most important was fully honest about it. But instead i find twofaced suck ups who only comment to have people around them. And honestly i cant take it anymore. Therefore ive decided to quit the art forum, and just be out of everybodys sight. Thats it. If the place i used to like dont care for me, then i wont care for the place... theres nothing left for me there anymore.

I was gonna add shoutouts here but it turned out i cant trust anyone anymore, after days and weeks of observing those who ive been in touch with. If i absolutely want to take anyones word seriously, it would be roughly these people:

PrinceFlea
PieLover61
ReNaeNae
Chymo
Captain-Ben

I guess that was all. Im tired of the art forum. Its been slightly 2 years now staying there, and im calling that shit off. From what ive seen, my work hasnt achieved any recognition simply because its bad as i can tell from peoples ignoring and excuses. Being aware of that, ive wanted to drop everything i have and walk off my merry way in utter shame. But ever since Captain-Ben persuaded me some few days ago with long texts to not quit everything, ive been kind of hesitating with departing and ive delayed this news post for weeks until now. But ive made my mind now, im outta this shit. Ive been enough embarrassed as it is.

Now something completely irrelevant:

Over a week ago i accidentally dropped my Creative Zen player on the concrete. Now the screen is all half white and full of rainbow lines. The color display is wrecked, not to mention ugly scratches even on the touch pad. Aint that a bitch. Im thinking of buying a new one, but i can only find "refurbished" versions of the player. Anyone have any idea what they mean by that? I dont exactly think its something all new, there must be something else behind this...


Comments (10)

I stopped going to the art forum as well. At the beginning it was great. I, too, remember when it was created, kicked off by the amazing dick chest-bursters art contest... it was a fairly small group of people once the original hubbub died down, and when I started posting my ugly drawings there, it seemed like I was actually fairly well known, and that when I posted things there I could count on at least a few people to recognize me and give feedback. But then, as always, it started filling up with more and more new users and I felt like most of the people who had stuck with the Art Forum from the beginning were being pushed out of the way to make room for a new generation of arrogant kids (crazerfish50) who were getting undeserved praise from all the OTHER new users. That and a general degeneration in quality was what propelled me away

refurbished means that it's an used/broken one that the store repaired.

Thats exactly what im saying! Also, your shit aint ugly... your JunkyCow era was full of clean work with bangin style mayn. And youre even bangin more today than ever so youve truly deserved all props and creds so far, AND da money prize. Too bad people were unnecessarily bumping other threads because of... pfffff vg references and anime. Dont you just hate it when some things become overrated? Like a fuckin jungle. And i was wondering where you went... how ironic. Oh yeah crazerfish... lmfao. Hes improved somewhat though, but hes still... asdfghgf

Also thanks for the additional info on refurbished. Its starting to scare me now. :o Should i go for it or not... hmff

Sucker! Now I've read all your art topic and all the others!
Seriously now, you do realize that all forums suck right? It's how it works.
It functions barely for awhile, then fuck! It gets down for whatever.
Like art sites being filled with fan art.

What you can do if you really wanna show your artz for peopluz then you can just create a forum with a free forum machine, invite just people that you like and bam! See what I'm saying?
I has a forumz... Members: 2.
Better than every art site and forum out there. WE WILL ROCK YOU!
BOOOOOOOM!

But do what you like man. Just use your head. If everyone hated you.
What would you do? And don't answer it's one of those questionsss...
KEBAB KEBAB KEBAB

Uhh well

like ive said above, ive found a new home which is also a forum. That place isnt completely crowded either, over there we keep it real and eat faggots for breakfast. Everybody there knows each others and its strictly business when it comes to art work. Its like a safe haven for me from all the faggotry out there. And uh no offense but, i have no plans on opening my own forum when i rather want feed back from people out there instead than just my close friends. I dont want a bunch of yes-people. I wouldnt be able to advance with only opinions from a limited range of people. I dont mind people in general as long as they dont suck up on me for some reason. Fuck em.

But yeah thanks for the suggestion, it COULD b an idea but i dont think itll happen. If everyone hated me i would ASDASDSAKJHDSVA,M,-

you should try a lamb shawarma, that shit is great.

Even after I've read everything, I still don't know what it was you want to do.
Animation?

Drawing in general. Illustration. Improve my art work and be happy with it. Thats what i want. Be praised for my work on the same level as others, that is if its even good at all. And be recognized for my efforts.

But the forum where ive been residing for a long time is neglecting me so im packin. But still much love to those who ive mentioned above in my news post, theyre the ones left who i can trust.

hey bro

I know what you mean.. i remember the so called "golden days", 'cause back then ( around last year?) i also couldnt get my ass of the art forum, remember?

i remember your drawings man, trust me they were cool even when you started posting, and the improvement you've shown is staggering. believe me.
your strokes have neatened up, and you've managed to shift your style to something interestingly new and more personal, which in my opinion is quite a big thing for an occasional illustrator like yours truly.

I've personally stop posting in the forum because i find that there is not one thread worth wasting time in.. since my pathetic attempt at an Enviroment of the Week failed at number 4 (..or 3?) and CHOWS and COWS went missing replaced by the same old crap i just said fuck it...

so i guess what i'm saying is good luck on your illustrations man, i hope you get where you dream of getting to.. but believe me forums all work the same way, eventually they all change.

TomAzza!

Yeah man, i was really attached to the forum. I had this special belonging feeling to it. And it really hurts when you feel bumped out considering how much time youve spent there. Im not taking any of that shit anymore.

And wow azza, you really mean it? I mean my past drawings looked like they came from a dumpster, but im still not acknowledging my so called skills to this day until ive reached where i wanna be and to my surprise someone like e-m-b-r-i-o suddenly showed up and reflected the similar style ive been desiring for... *sigh* whatever i still like him. But, if you really think ive come far then thanks :D I appreciate this feed back from a fellow old reg a lot.

And i understand what you mean about the threads. And ive also felt pretty much like ive failed in every recent drawing. Plus ive had it with everybody clumping up and ganging up and having some sort of gay social groups of their own. Y'know i would love to give feed back on EVERY thread on the page (i remember i used to stroll by every each of them last year), but ive pretty much given up doing that. What a waste of time.

And thanksssssss mayn. I will still have a dream thanks to those who are left to support me, including you. :) The question is, when will i get there? The fight continues. The art forum has indeed changed a lot. Its gotten... mainstream. I hate that place now. Theyre not worth my time anymore. One less thing to be worried about. And im sure as hell that my new home wont be THAT gay... hopefully. Its different than all the others... thanks for dropping by bro!

The shit I'm gunna say won't be thought out, clever, smart or angry. I suck at that.

Y'know this reminds me of when I used to play WoW. Me and my brother started out on a new server with some friends and it was awesome. We got to the top level and we were known by alot of people. The same people. The reg's. But then it al started changing and when the first expanson came out the game went down the shitter. Loads of new players, all stupid and talking shit. They didn't know anyone and showed no respect to the heroes of the old times. It got me so mad and I quit. I know it's stupid and it's just running away but it's basically the same as what you're doing. I'm not saying you should quit the forum because you obviously don't think you belong here. I don't want to force you to stay out of guilt I want you to do what you're happy with. I don't know where I'm going with this so NEXT PARAGRAPH!

You're art isn't shitty. I'm quite a new fellow, I started early 2008/ late 2007 and I still havn't made a name for myself. I don't know why but I really want some recognition on this site. I know it's stupid. Trying to get famous on a website full of idiots. Wait, this is about your art - Well, I remember the first thing I actually saw from you was a picture of Renamon for Scorpian. I really, really liked it and thought "he posts alot, why have I never seen his stuff?". I think you;re not really recognised is because you don't post your art in any other places besides your own thread. And I don't like looking at threads with more than 3 pages, so I never checked yours out. I still haven't (sorry), but I think if you posted more in the other threads, the little ones, then you'd get more fans. You may say your art isn't "good" because like most people you're modest or whatever, but alot of people will like it. I do.

I know I should be saying lots more stuff but I can't think of anything without planning it out. Whatever, do what you think is best but DON'T STOP hating your art. Yeah, no spelling mistakes there (I think), don't stop hating it. If you hate it then that's enough inspiration to improve. The more you hate it the more things you can pick out and decide how to improve, practice more on that than other things. More reassuring text here.

Laters Hammi, good luck!

PieLover, the forum already frustrates the fuck out of me. I remember i never cared about being "important" whatever, i was around helping only for sheer joy. At the same time i wanted to be a part of a community where we all were raising and helping out fellow artists. But it turned out that not even half of the community really seemed to notice my efforts, or even me. It came to me through the very first art forum awards, and that was like a kick in the balls for me. Ok so im a rug now? ALRIGHT PEOPLE FINE, HAVE IT YOUR WAY. Why the fuck should i stay any longer? Fuck em all.

It depends on for what reason you wish to seek recognition for. At first i just wanted to be a part of the community, it was until later on when i wanted recognition for my efforts on both being loyal and improving my art work because i spent a good deal of time there. Im not aiming on being "popular" or "famous" because thats just stupid. I just wanted to be appreciated the way i appreciate other people. As for that Renamon drawing, that goofy looking trash means nothing to me anymore... fuck that shit. And ive been careful not to whore out my art work on different threads cause i dont wanna be an attention whore, that it would make people think that i got some sort of an ego to toss my shit around. The only way i want people to come is if my art work got what it takes to capture their interests. By staying true to my posts while i submit my work, but shit. Its not even worth their time, i can damn well notice that. OH WELL. If theyre too lazy to see through threads, how come they quickly notice people who are better than me? Dont even answer, its self explanatory. Even you discovered the best of talents in the forum. It took a request from scorpian to have you finding my work, because it was via HIM that i was recognized... and now you like it because him and i used to be friends. This is not how i wanted it. And once again my incompetence shines through. If people really liked my work, they would be INTERESTED and come over asking for more and be INTO it. Pff.

And i wont stop hating my art, ive been doing that most of my time. Ive been working on improving a ton, and ive wanted to push it to the limit. But ive been depressed before from hating my art work, and myself. Ive been pretty much depressed for a long time. Im quite jaded now... only time will reveal whatever that will lie ahead of me.

well after reading all this I have sorta de-covered how you are feeling and know how it must suck to be ignored, I really can't say how the golden age of the art form is actually like for i have only been and the art form for a couple months, but I do remember seeing your art forum for the first time I actually spent a good amount of time going threw all the pages of it and to tell you I really liked the stuff you had made it just had something about it that i really liked. but I can't feel how you felt when the 2007 art forum awards came around and after all your time on here not getting a though about, but if i was in your position I would have also been depressed but don't think people don't accept you advice cause I remember the post you have made on my forum and hammi you are probably that person who has help me improve allot you comments are never just good job you actually told me straight out what I should improve on and for that I am thankful for it :D but this is not about me it is about you. well this all comes down to this the final discion is up to you if you leave or not nothing i will say will change your mind but if you do leave I myself would actually love to still see you around hopefully and still giving out the helpful advice like you have always done :D, but in the end Hammi we will respect your disunion and hopefully in the future see more from you till then I hope you keep in touch Sincerely
DRAKENYAZE

good luck in you life :D

So you really went through my entire art thread :x Its kind of embarrassing. So much eye rape. Ah well, at least it shows that youve been curious about my work. Dunno if you were interested in it though.

I feel like a door mat whenever i give people advice. Sometimes i think my crits are bad which is why people shrug or never salute back. I know youre just here to cheer me up by telling me that ive been that "special" yiddi yaddi person who have helped you the most in improving. I dont think so, im not a superhero like some people already make it out to look like just because of me leaving... but i do acknowledge your appreciation for my advices. Im glad ive been of any help. :)

And thanks for respecting my choices Drakenyaze. Im just a wandering fool in the art forum anyway with nothing else to do. As for the community, they can help themselves. As if i was the one to make any difference. HAH. Nothing will EVER change with me leaving. Itll always be the same humpty hump business over there, where favoritism over friends and regs will continue to rule. I have no love for that place. I got no one to keep in touch with there anymore, and i wont plan on doing so either. Unless anyone reminisces and wants to check up on me, i will gladly answer back just for the chatter :)

Have fun.

Damn, I missed all this during the camp...

So, this is how it ends...?
Well, I am in no spot to tell you to reconsider, it has been a nice experience with you here on NG art forums, that I have to admit. But I honor your decision and push the matter no further.

Hopefully we bumb into each other in the future!

Whatever.

Sadly I had lost faith in the Art forums as well, and for sometime. While you tried, as well as a few others. The trolls,griefers, spammers, where just taking any and all fun out of the place. What used to be fun skimming thru others work, became a chore, of bad PShopped images, porn and whatever you can think of. and that was my morning on that site, almost everyday. The contests fell by the waistside because we felt very few people were trying. you had the few regulars, then you had the lazy spammers who made making any contests a complete choir. Thankfully though thats about to change with the art portal, and hopefully it will reinvigorate some newlife into the forums as well. since there will be more options and sizes and resolutions, newer artist wont be put off by the restrictions and hopefully everyone will be happy this time,

Expect a new shot of adrenaline shot into the veins of that forum very soon.

Yeah. Not only the spammers and the trollers were the big sharks in the water though. There have been self centering pretentious artists who couldnt give two shits about anything else but his/her own work. Destroying what used to be fun in the forum and turning the place into a popularity contest altogether. And unfortunately, the way the forum was developing into had me developing an ego as well just to keep up with everyone else. I became angsty and bitter, because the forum made me this way. My patience was up. Even though ive quit the forum, i still wont go back to my old self ever again. Ive had it with being naive.

As for the art portal, i will admit i do carry on a feeling of curiosity surrounding this new feature. I will look into it. But dont expect me to return to the forum again, no. Ill let them think happy happy thoughts in their precious bubbles like they always have while i mind my own business. I just hope the art portal wont be too much for me to handle. As long as it doesnt remind me of or resemble the art forum... i rather wanna forget about that it ever existed.

I think people are holding out for the art portal. I think an art forum is a hard apple to bite.. its really hard to follow and posting art in a forum was never really that convenient or conventional. If anything the art forum should be more about 'discussing' art and not so much showing off your own in a series of threads.

I think the Art forum served its purpose while the art portal came along and now that its soon to arrive im comfortable with the community sort of straying a bit because the ArtP will open so many more doors for artists to be able to share their art and actually catalogue and chronicle them. It was annoying having to check back on a thread just to see if JunkyCow felt like updating his shit. Id much rather stroll by a userpage and see things popup as they emerge. Kinda like Camp North is doing, that site filled in where NG lagged behind on.

I guess youre right man. I mean theres a difference between a forum and a portal. But then again, a forum would be more accurate on the opinions that people give about your art work. Its not like "yeah cool pic dude" or "its okay keep it up". The art forum on the other hand is like:

feedback: cool work man, its great!

artist: thanks man. hm... why is it great? any suggestion where i can improve?

feedback: i love the color/tone/details and the style its pretty unique/whatever! maybe you should work more on the <insert flaw> and it will look better. :)

artist: alright gotcha. thanks! im glad you liked it, i appreciate that. :D

feedback: no problem dude, i like your work. ;) keep it up!

Its like an all in one thing y'know. But i cant stand the place now, the way its treated me for 2 years. God i sound so repetitive. Well youre right about the art portal though, im sure it will be an all new good feature for most artists on NG. And im not sure if Ansel will come back for the portal though, he abandoned his art thread in the forum and linked it to his deviantart page instead. And yes its rather tiring to browse back to your favorite artists/friends. Camp North is a good site that indeed fills in these issues. I mean, it actually works. But just fyi, Zellomesh was there first before CN :P The only problem was that the portal was buggy. I already know you have a bad impression of ZM, just thought id add to it since we're on about art portals. I guess Camp North has made it extra interesting and exciting with their art battle feature and all. Kudos to them.

To be honest, it sounds like you just want the recognition without all the insane work.

sure, you've worked hard, and 2 years is a long time, and you've improved,. I've worked much harder than you and much longer, and I don't even come close art-wise to my inspirations. But I keep at it.
You need to prioritize what it is, you actually want . Do you want to do art for the rest of your life? or Be popular. Being part of a group or click, is very romantic, and addictive. And Sometimes people want that click and don't even realize it has nothing to do with drawing.

So you need to ask yourself, Do you do art for the joy it gives you? or to be part of some community?

I know I've been drawing all my life, without internet, by myself in a room, most of the time against family wishes, knowing full well, no one would see, or comment on my work. I did it for the pure joy of it.

If you are getting upset because you aren't getting enough positive responses, then somethings wrong. Get better because you want to, and when you do, people will recognize it on their own.

remember...

the recognition is a Plus, NOT the goal.

:\

Yeah its true, it was until later when i started craving for recognition. Its just that i felt left out, while everybody else had fun with their own and made great art. And i felt like shit. I guess thats where my way of thinking started changing... i know its bad, but its not easy either to stop looking at the others while bearing a great feeling of envy. Ill tell ya a lot of things and thoughts started boiling in my head with millions of questions and comprehensions about peoples view on my work, all in different twists. Drove me mad.

I used to draw for fun. But i also wanted to be a serious artist. I figured this was the way to go if i ever wanted to improve. By focusing on achievements and grow confidence from them. I started wanting for a piece of the "art forum cake". Sounds like a game of win or lose huh. My pride went down with it. Now everybody around me tell me to work on my self-esteem, as if THAT WOULD BE EASY PEASY. And this is also one of the reasons why i left the forum and completely stopped drawing. Because i need to get rid of the ego and the competition mood that had infested inside of me since the start of 07. Disease. So yeah, ive iced everything. And its unknown if ill ever recover. If ill ever draw again. All my confidence and my original purposes have all gone up in smoke. Whats left for me is to pick up what i got left and start everything again from the scratch and IF i ever return, it will be for true purposes and not for the "cake". I got sucked into it for 2 whole years. And what ive learned is that everything around here is a waste of time. I mean who cares? I dont... anymore. Ive stopped relying on other people for confidence. I based all my efforts on their views. Well i aint giving them any more "trust" for them to frolic on. Fuck them. Im currently working on pulling that shit out of myself instead, and nurture it so i can learn to trust myself. Learn to appreciate my own efforts. Start putting my views in new perspectives and try not to let anyones arrogance get to me. If ill ever draw again, it will be only for myself and not for others. Thats a firm decision ive made and living up to now. Only then i believe i can be happy again... i hope. The biggest war you can have is with yourself, a wise prophet once said.

Also i appreciate your honesty MC, it really means a lot to me. Straight down to business, providing your personal thoughts around it before wild assumptions escalate. Shit that makes sense. Its like gold to me. Its easy to trust you because youve been like this from day 1. I cant stand people kissing ass all the time just to be "friends" with me, like SOME CERTAIN PEOPLE DO. Thank you man. I know youve been working hard all these years, which is why i admire you so much. Like a role model. And i aint bullshittin, this is real talk. You probably know this already lmao. Sorry. I just couldnt agree with you more than this.

I will try getting rid of all the "lazy talk" inside of me, and grow again... some day. Or never... only time will reveal.